Obama invokes race card

[{OF}Blong]

lol looks like chem kinda got owned. Either way the only people that didnt work hard to become rich are those who got richness handed to them. Look at Bill Gates as a prime example. You mean to tell me that he didnt work hard to get to where he and his company is? He had to work hard to get to where he is now. The people I know who have $$$ worked very hard to get to where they are as well as to stay where they are.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by {OF}Blong

lol looks like chem kinda got owned. Either way the only people that didnt work hard to become rich are those who got richness handed to them. Look at Bill Gates as a prime example. You mean to tell me that he didnt work hard to get to where he and his company is? He had to work hard to get to where he is now. The people I know who have $$$ worked very hard to get to where they are as well as to stay where they are.

i'm assuming chem is going off the same kind of thing coworkers went off of when i was working at ihop. they thought they worked hard too. it's a different kind of work, people that are rich work hard by being intelligent and creating the work themselves, not by just doing whatever work is handed to them

oh and as for iraq. i would hardly call wanting to see an end in sight after 5 years being instant gratification...how long did WWI/II last? how about the civil war? the revolutionary war? etc etc majority of wars that actually ended had been decided by now. iraq will be the new vietnam and i don't see how anyone can deny that. we're fighting an endless cause. you can't force democracy onto someone that doesn't want it, it's only going to make them even more pissed at us. it's a tough call on whether we should have gone there in the first place. on one hand you had the UN doing sanction after sanction on saddam and he kept ignoring them and the UN just let him with empty threats. the US followed up on them and got **** for it. but the US should have been able to tell that this war would not end very quickly and i'm not sure it's worth it

[{OF}Blong]

Originally Posted by Cheese

i'm assuming chem is going off the same kind of thing coworkers went off of when i was working at ihop. they thought they worked hard too. it's a different kind of work, people that are rich work hard by being intelligent and creating the work themselves, not by just doing whatever work is handed to them

oh and as for iraq. i would hardly call wanting to see an end in sight after 5 years being instant gratification...how long did WWI/II last? how about the civil war? the revolutionary war? etc etc majority of wars that actually ended had been decided by now. iraq will be the new vietnam and i don't see how anyone can deny that. we're fighting an endless cause. you can't force democracy onto someone that doesn't want it, it's only going to make them even more pissed at us. it's a tough call on whether we should have gone there in the first place. on one hand you had the UN doing sanction after sanction on saddam and he kept ignoring them and the UN just let him with empty threats. the US followed up on them and got **** for it. but the US should have been able to tell that this war would not end very quickly and i'm not sure it's worth it

It is harder to create work than it is to do whats already been created. Ok not in all instances but in most. But those with money most of them had to work harder than those who work at ihop because they had to

1. go to school or learn very quickly on their own.
2. Give someone a reason to promote them upwards.
3. Use their brains to solve complex problems that may/may not have a solutions.
I mean I could go on. the person working at Ihop just has to remember someones order or attempt to get the order right and most (not all) of them get that wrong all the time as it is. Do they work hard physically? yes esp during rush hour. Do they work hard mentally? no not really. from my experiences Mental work is WWWAAAYYY harder than physical work. Physical work is easy compared to some of the mental work that needs to be performed.

[ChemicalWarrior]

Originally Posted by [DvT]UY

blah, blah...

You and the rest of the world won't get a clue to any progress or not of what has occure din Iraq for some years yet to come. You are just another example of the instant gratification generation.

Britain in the 1920s to the early 1930s held control of Iraq and tried to spread peace to this area. It is not 70+ years later and where are we now? These people don't want us in their business. The biggest conflict with this area of the world is not one of ideal but one of us always being in their land! Terrorism is a tactic that goes back thousands of years, sometimes its called revolution especially when in a domestic context. Revolution, or terrorism, arises when a people feel the need to free themselves from foreign rule. While you will certainly try to say I'm crazy for drawing this line you've clearly showed on a few occasions now that you don't view things in a historical point. The best way to understand man is to watch him.

Do I believe momentary peace in Iraq is possible within the next twenty years? Yes. Do I think lasting peace is within hand in that time span? No. Do I think lasting peace is attainable through violence or occupation or forced "understanding"? No. Our current methods are nothing more than occupational tactics used in order to force our views on a people who are culturally vastly different. It is this misunderstanding of people in general that will always lead our efforts down a wrong path. Frankly I'm opposed against our current involvement based on this philosophy and past similar circumstances. It is well beyond simply disliking an administration, it is instead a dislike of our thinking as a country and body of people.

Originally Posted by [DvT]UY

lol! We didn't force Saddam to be a major asshole.

No we didn't, but then again that's not at all what I'm arguing about.

Originally Posted by [DvT]UY

You so easily forget, the whole world was in on it including the democrats. would you life me to post the audio/video of all the demos who were in favor of going into Iraq convinced they had WMD? Just say the word.

I know that and to be honest my opinion of the Democratic party is just as harsh as to the one for Republican, in fact in general I find my views to lean much more towards being conservative and would be a strong supporter of a socially conscious conservative but no such candidate exists, and using the more classical term for conservative. But again that was not my point at all. When further information came out to the contrary it was the Bush administration who switched the gears and pushed further. There was hardly any further investigation about those matters and instead the new issues were blindly disregarded. Why was there no longer discussions or clarification when it switched from "Saddam has weapons!" to "Saddam violates civil rights" (which itself is incredibly ironic consider the current administrations stance on the ones we have in the US)?

Originally Posted by [DvT]UY

What would you know about being a combat soldier? Answer = nothing.

I know what I've been told by those who have served in a number of wars both current and past. I've actively sought out people who have served in order to hear their thoughts on the subjects. No, I haven't served but I feel I have some grasp to the thinking process or at least the results of that thinking process.

Originally Posted by [DvT]UY

Justifying taking out Saddam is easy...he broke every rule in the book unless of course you are a stupid liberal who plays by no rules.

You can't put a man on trial for armed robbery then sentence him for murder, even if he did commit a murder. You instead bring up a different charge for both.

Originally Posted by [DvT]UY

Most of the rich have worked very hard to get where they are at. I suppose I should overlook future incoherent babblings from you.

Worked. Please mind the use of past and present tense. Please also realize the difference between being aware of reality and supporting reality.

Originally Posted by {OF}Blong

lol looks like chem kinda got owned. Either way the only people that didnt work hard to become rich are those who got richness handed to them. Look at Bill Gates as a prime example. You mean to tell me that he didnt work hard to get to where he and his company is? He had to work hard to get to where he is now. The people I know who have $$$ worked very hard to get to where they are as well as to stay where they are.

No Bill Gates really didn't work hard. He's not the best designer, programmer, or anything else. Instead he was a pretty dirty rotten business man who was slightly more agile then another dirty rotten business man; Steve Jobs. There is a vast (VAST) different between well off, not having to worry about going into retirement, and being rich. You seem to lack understanding of the difference.

[Soul]

Totaly off topic, however I saw vast and thought VAST = Visual Audio Sensory Theater, man I haven't listened to them for a long time.

Thanks Chem

[{DvT}Reckless]

Speaking of Obama my latest hobby at work is to ask ANY Obama supporter one simple, basic question. Then I sit back, eat my lunch, check my mail, check how my stocks are doing etc, etc, etc:

Can you tell me what you consider Obama's greatest acomplishment is so far in his political career?

Working in ultra-liberal Marin county California this simple question draws extended periods of silence. The answers, well I have yet to receive an actual answer. I initially thought this was funny, but in reality it's quite sad.

I also truly appreciate this essay. Unsure of the author, but my guess is he/she was a Republican

Father/Daughter Talk
A young woman was about to finish her first year of college. Like so many others her age, she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat, and among other liberal ideals, was very much in favor of higher taxes to support more government programs, in other words redistribution of wealth.
She was deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican, a feeling she openly expressed. Based on the lectures that she had participated in, and the occasional chat with a professor, she felt that her father had for years harbored an evil, selfish desire to keep what he thought should be his.
One day she was challenging her father on his opposition to higher taxes on the rich and the need for more government programs. The self-professed objectivity proclaimed by her professors had to be the truth and she indicated so to her father. He responded by asking how she was doing in school.
Taken aback, she answered rather haughtily that she had a 4.0 GPA, and let him know that it was tough to maintain, insisting that she was taking a very difficult course load and was constantly studying, which left her no time to go out and party like other people she knew. She didn't even have time for a boyfriend, and didn't really have many college friends because she spent all her time studying.
Her father listened and then asked, 'How is your friend Audrey doing?' She replied, 'Audrey is barely getting by. All she takes are easy classes, she never studies, and she barely has a 2.0 GPA. She is so popular on campus; college for her is a blast. She's always invited to all the parties and lots of times she doesn't even show up for classes because she's too hung over.'
Her wise father asked his daughter, 'Why don't you go to the Dean's office and ask him to deduct 1.0 off your GPA and give it to your friend who only has a 2.0. That way you will both have a 3.0 GPA and certainly that would be a fair and equal distribution of GPA.'
The daughter, visibly shocked by her father's suggestion, angrily fired back, 'That's a crazy idea, and how would that be fair! I've worked really hard for my grades! I've invested a lot of time, and a lot of hard work! Audrey has done next to nothing toward her degree. She played while I worked my tail off!'
The father slowly smiled, winked and said gently, 'Welcome to the Republican party.'

[{DvT}Rhino]

Originally Posted by {DvT}Reckless

Can you tell me what you consider Obama's greatest acomplishment is so far in his political career?

That's easy, running for President!

[[DvT]UY]

Originally Posted by {DvT}Rhino

That's easy, running for President!

Beat me to it... heh

[[DvT]UY]

Originally Posted by {DvT}Reckless

Speaking of Obama my latest hobby at work is to ask ANY Obama supporter one simple, basic question. Then I sit back, eat my lunch, check my mail, check how my stocks are doing etc, etc, etc:

Can you tell me what you consider Obama's greatest acomplishment is so far in his political career?

Working in ultra-liberal Marin county California this simple question draws extended periods of silence. The answers, well I have yet to receive an actual answer. I initially thought this was funny, but in reality it's quite sad.

I also truly appreciate this essay. Unsure of the author, but my guess is he/she was a Republican

Father/Daughter Talk
A young woman was about to finish her first year of college. Like so many others her age, she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat, and among other liberal ideals, was very much in favor of higher taxes to support more government programs, in other words redistribution of wealth.
She was deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican, a feeling she openly expressed. Based on the lectures that she had participated in, and the occasional chat with a professor, she felt that her father had for years harbored an evil, selfish desire to keep what he thought should be his.
One day she was challenging her father on his opposition to higher taxes on the rich and the need for more government programs. The self-professed objectivity proclaimed by her professors had to be the truth and she indicated so to her father. He responded by asking how she was doing in school.
Taken aback, she answered rather haughtily that she had a 4.0 GPA, and let him know that it was tough to maintain, insisting that she was taking a very difficult course load and was constantly studying, which left her no time to go out and party like other people she knew. She didn't even have time for a boyfriend, and didn't really have many college friends because she spent all her time studying.
Her father listened and then asked, 'How is your friend Audrey doing?' She replied, 'Audrey is barely getting by. All she takes are easy classes, she never studies, and she barely has a 2.0 GPA. She is so popular on campus; college for her is a blast. She's always invited to all the parties and lots of times she doesn't even show up for classes because she's too hung over.'
Her wise father asked his daughter, 'Why don't you go to the Dean's office and ask him to deduct 1.0 off your GPA and give it to your friend who only has a 2.0. That way you will both have a 3.0 GPA and certainly that would be a fair and equal distribution of GPA.'
The daughter, visibly shocked by her father's suggestion, angrily fired back, 'That's a crazy idea, and how would that be fair! I've worked really hard for my grades! I've invested a lot of time, and a lot of hard work! Audrey has done next to nothing toward her degree. She played while I worked my tail off!'
The father slowly smiled, winked and said gently, 'Welcome to the Republican party.'

lol...reminds me of the ant & the grasshopper story. Good one Reck.

[{DvT}JonahHex]

Now the questions become when, where, and how is the current incarnation of the Republican Party actually practicing that economic philosophy?

Paying for war with tax cuts, maybe? Allowing the credit industry to work hard and earn huge profits by ripping off the middle class and their investors? Allowing money to "trickle down" rather than "flow down" so a 2-income family has become the norm?

Fiscally responsible Republicans are a myth.