SUV suggestions?

[ClydeFrog]

Lopo, my second paragraph is just a rant at the media in general. There is a lot of BS out there masquerading as objective news and it gets under my skin. My apologies if I didn't explain that better. All I took you to task for personally was "The ford shouldn't be on your list.... if we're talking about reliability". Since this is now morphing this into something about grocery getting and the off road aftermarket I'm going to assume my point was made.

Originally Posted by {OF}RKT

I think it's quite understandable Clyde how you feel and your frustration with certain prejudices from the past can be frustrating.

So here is the question, how does the US automakers get the US market back?

I don't buy in this 100% reliability issue. I mean look at the Koreans. When they first hit the market, their cars were aweful. But they stuck to it, were patient and have slowly gained acceptance in the US. I believe Korean car sales continue to grow at a huge rate in the US. Why? I don't see a Korean car any better then a big three car, in fact I still think they have qaulity issues.

Is it price? I think you get more for your money with a domestic car then you do a rival Japanese car. Incentives? The domestics seem alot more aggressive in offering rebates and factory sponsered pricing then the Japanese.

Is it performance? The popular purchased Japanese cars, Toyota Camary, Honda Accord sell far more 4 cylinder then 6 cylinder cars.

Is it fuel efficiency? Ummm... I can cry that my Acura RL gets pretty crappy gas mileage at 19mpg city. Hell my Acura MDX would get 16mpg.

For the life of me, I can't put pulse on it.

Great question RK! I wish I had the exact answer but in my opinion the number one thing is styling. Sure everyone says they care most about reliability, safety, fuel economy, etc but that's not really true. People shop for cars like guys shop for girlfriends. Sure you have to have a girl that's smart, sweet and stable ... but if you don't find her attractive it just doesn't work.

The second thing is reversing some of the tide of negative perception. This is really tough because the media reporting generally doesn't go beyond skin deep on any issue. The currently accepted view is as good as truth and there is a human tendency that once something is a target let's keep kicking it forever. To get past that you have to force people to rethink and even stand up and cheer. This is where something like the Chevy Volt can be worth its weight in gold. This is also where the Big 3 missed the boat with the small hybrid cars. They didn't make any economical sense when gas was essentially free - and they still don't at $2.50 a gallon - but they give people something to feel good about which is invaluable. I have noticed that Toyota's hybrid green luster seems to be finally fading ... just in time for them to open their new Tundra plant which will double their fullsize truck output. It will be interesting to see how that plays out.

As Toyota continues to grow the news of their recalls and quality problems will start to be reported (and probably blown out of proportion) as gleefully as the Big 3 problems have been in the past. It's already happening to a degree.

As far as the hate for the UAW I don't know when that's going to end. A lot of people are still hostile because they think a bunch of "uneducated" autoworkers are making more than they are. The rank and file situation doesn't even remotely resemble the perception of "lazy and surly with janitors making $100k". Unfortunately, the leadership is still saber rattling over things like the jobs bank and that's what makes the newspapers, reinforcing the old stereotypes.

I don't think the Big 3 will ever have the massive majority market shares of the past unless there are major changes in the market. There are too many global players today for that to be realistic. I do think they can take some back and hold it but it's going to take at least one more design cycle with attractive vehicles, (unfortunately) lower prices, high quality and ideally something attention grabbing (be it awesome styling trend, fuel cell, or some other technology) new to force people to take a second look.

[{OF}RKT]

BTW, I was a Union Steward for UAW64 back in the 80's

So after posting my original post, I thought to myself, why did I get what I got.

It's my 3rd Acura from the same dealership. It really turns out it's not so much the car, reputation, reliability as much as the service and attention I get from the dealership. One, they have yet to not live up to a promise they have made. They have always quoted the lowest price and they treat my like a King when I am having service.

My 2nd Acura was an MDX, a great SUV but it had a major electrical problem on the steering column that controls the audio controls. I brought it in 5 times before they got it right. Now normally I would have gone ballistic but everytime I brought it in, they had a loaner car waiting for me. When I picked the car up, the car was fully detailed inside and out. If I had to wait, they would let me use one of their offices for emails and phone calls. They also have hot coffee and cold beverages available for me and other customers any time. They even once offered to bring in lunch for me when we were working on the sale of my third car.

It's the little things that keep customers loyal. Lexus and Acura seemed to do it well.